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Conversation #7: Not Fearing for Life

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rayuu
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Keep the conversation civil and let us know what you think about this and if anything should be added or taken from this!

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Not Fearing for Life
We get that you are playing a game and fearing for your life is difficult when you can just respawn as if nothing ever happened, but this is a roleplay server and as such you are playing as a human being who has a life within the city of Los Santos.

  • You should treat your every move as if it would affect you in real life as that character. For example: If someone points a weapon at you and you don't have one out already, you do NOT start reaching for your weapon or running away as this simply wouldn't happen if you were fearing for your life. You would however freeze in place and put your hands up and thus surrender.
  • You may not roleplay as someone immune to fear or being hurt.
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Zopfco

Like the other rules, I would lose the intro bit, as I think it dilutes the message & could be interpreted as rationalizing.

  • Characters should demonstrate a normal concern for their own self-preservation.  For instance, complying when held at gunpoint or not throwing yourself off a skyscraper to escape police custody.
  • You may not RP as someone exempt from this rule for whatever reason

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Diezel

I agree we need to make sure things aren't always so long winded. And we cannot say treat our every move as it were real life. There has been more than a few times id have to be told how this isnt real life. So having things like that in your rules will break the argument.


Not Fearing for Life
Characters experience fear in different ways, not everyone is sweating bullets and shaking. However this doesn't mean you are immune to showing fear. You need to show value in attempting not being knocked down.

  • Characters should always show concern for being downed.  
  • While on foot if someone points a gun at you, and you do not have a gun out, your character should be concerned for being shot and listen to instructions.
  • You may not roleplay as someone immune to fear or being hurt.
  • You cannot escape police custody by a suicidal jump. Just because you can be picked up by EMS or respawn after some time, doesn't allow you to blatantly throw yourself over a bridge.

Being aimed at in a car should be considered differently. Honestly it can go different ways. If someone aimed a gun at me IRL while i was in my car, i would probably duck and gas peddle. I can't say people hitting someone with a car to get away from danger would be not fearing for life, but actually fearing for life. 

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valerio

I think this rule is one of the most unfollowed rules that we have. I'm not applying this to everyone, there is just a LOT of people who I have seen take this rule very, VERY lightly. 

I've seen a lot of instances where people egg on the one with the gun. I've heard quotes like, "Go on, shoot me. We'll hunt you down" and a lot of time stalling (i.e. being held up at gunpoint, robber asks victim to give him cash, victim keeps talking and talking, biding time for someone to save them). Also seen a lot of instances where people will be held up and they pull out their phones. 

I don't want to stomp on other people's RP. I get that no one wants to be a wimp and you want to be a badass hero. But considering the fact that you have a gun to your head, and you're telling me to "pull the trigger" and "do it" cause you and your boys are gonna hunt me down is asinine. Now I understand, I'm partly at fault for not recording and reporting every one of these instances. However, the fact that people are so comfortable with dying is worrying. 

I think this also ties into people getting shot and medical roleplay. A lot of time when people are shot, they continue speaking like normal, "Oh, so and so shot me" or "Yea, I was shot in my arm" said calmly instead of dropping unconscious due to blood loss or screaming in pain. I feel like going to a hospital should be a BIG thing, not just doc throws me in for 5 minutes and back out on the street. It's hard to enforce that though, but the ideals still stand that Not Fearing for Life plays into shitty medical roleplay. 


I've been under the impression that when you get shot or get injured, you forget your memory of what exactly happened (it was all a blur). I've lived with that rule for a while now. Let me give a perfect example of an instance. 


We forced someone down at the docks, tied up, no phone, no radio, because he screwed up bad. We made sure we weren't followed, alone, and no one could've possibly known it was us. Our secret would sleep with the fishes. Put a couple of bullets into him, we leave the scene. Come to find out that he told EMS and all of his boys that it was us and they came back asking questions. 

I know this is bleeding into other rule territory. My main issue is that there is no concern for any consequences AFTER the fact. As it stands right now, nothing in the above segment is against the rules. The fact that we just shot a person does not inspire fear into that person, making him stay silent in case we come back to finish the job or his boys. Instead it's the usual "we're coming for revenge" story I've heard a million times over. 

A lot of people don't fear going to the hospital, getting shot, suffering horrible injuries. Most people play it off as a joke, stoically calm, or garnering revenge. I'm not saying these are necessarily bad, given certain scenarios, but it is wildly over done and breeds into bad roleplay overall. 

The main takeaway I think should be looked at is consequences of some sort, to make people afraid of dying or going to the hospital. Maybe hospital fines become a thing, no one wants to pay a lot of money over and over again. On the more extreme side, 3 times killed by a player with reason could perma your character. I know it's extreme, and may be looked at as easily abusable, but most people forget that we are roleplay over gunplay  and firing weapons shouldn't need to be necessary for quality roleplay. 


TL;DR: A lot of players tend to break this rule due to it be hard to enforce. People have gotten too comfortable getting shot, maimed, or injured with no consequence. It bleeds into other rules and roleplay, such as medical roleplay and anti-deathmatch, breeding bad roleplay. Some form of consequences should be added, both in rule and gameplay.

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Zopfco

I don't want to quote the whole post, but ALL of this above ^^  I wish we still had the New Life Rule but understand it was unenforceable given the possible loopholes.

you're telling me to "pull the trigger" and "do it" cause you and your boys are gonna hunt me down is asinine

Let's be honest; it's not because you'll be "hunted down", it's because they're going to do a 10 minute timeout & lose a gun (assuming they don't tell EMS they rolled their ankle and fell in the spaghetti) then go right back to doing whatever they were doing.  

Ultimately we can write rules that are clear as day but we're never going to cover every possible scenario.  At some point it's simply up to the player not to fail RP.  Maybe we need a catch-all rule like that with a minimal points violation (or just a warning for first offenders?) to cover these edge cases? That way it can be addressed but no one is catching bans for something not clearly defined unless it becomes a pattern.

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Yung Sleezus

I agree with some of the points made. This is more of a feedback point than a response to the rules but what Valerio said about maybe a small medical bill of $1500 every time you get checked into the ER without being clocked in as EMS or LSPD/SASP. 

The only thing I've been unclear about with this rule personally is timing. Let's say I've been around long enough and I know how the city works. I'm on the side of the road walking to the Grove St gas station when I see a car zoom in front of me and skid to a stop and a dude hops out and I can see a shotgun on his back. I know he's about to rob me or atleast confront me in some way about why I'm there. If I go to pull out my gun and we end up almost frame perfect pulling our guns out at the same time...what is that? Would we be within the rules to both have guns on each other and have a standoff of sorts or would I as the potential victim have to play dumb and let the situation play out, ie me never reach for my gun? I know something like that is hard to clarify in the rules but I think it provides good RP and rewards you for experience and street knowledge to be able to basically call what's about to happen and go into a type of stalemate.


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